Never went to an LHS

The loosing of LHS's reflective of another "paradigm shift"

The fact many people in the "Gen-X" and "Millennial" demographic groups don't consider personal one-on-one interaction important is another reason why shopping at LHS's might be decreasing.  Today, many don't mind interacting on some type of device (be it computer, smart phone, etc).  To some, gathering at a local hobby shop might even be considered an anathema . 

Though i am a member of "Gen-Xer's" I can remember when going to college stopping by the local hobby shop a couple miles from the college, often to buy stuff, but to always sit around to visit with the owner and the usual "gang" that would hang around throughout the day (mostly retired persons).  I would gain so much knowledge and information from them, i don't think I remember it all.  I miss those days.

Ken L.

Good local hobby shops still exist.

I'm fortunate that my LHS is actually local. Local as in 2 blocks from my work. Dropping by to just pick up a small item or something more substantial is a real high point in my day.

 I've probably been to 50 + hobby shops in my time and like any retail store they vary in many ways but the most significant factor to me is the human one. I go to the hobby store to not only pick up supplies but to escape the daily grind and immerse myself in one of the few things that gives me creative outlet. I'm there to talk model railroading and a good shop owner knows this...........politics, religion and current events I discuss elsewhere!

 To the OP. It isn't all about nostalgia. As much as anything it is about camaraderie (yes, I did have to look up the spelling).

Anyway, I've got my LHS (Central Coast Trains in Atascadero, CA) and I'm one lucky camper.

 Let's don't wish them away so casually.

Central Coast Trains in Atascadero, CA

Do you do any railfanning down there? I'm wondering how busy the coast line is these days. I rarely see any thru trains at Watsonville .....DaveB

central coast railfanning

Not enough traffic to really warrant any railfanning. Other than Amtrack, usually one freight train a day, occasionally two. 

 Many moons ago used to enjoy seeing the local out of Salinas and really loved seeing the seasonal sugar beet trains heading to Santa Maria but those days are long gone.

usually one freight train a day, occasionally two

How about the Wunpost oil cans? Do they still run ? ...DaveB

My local hobby shop is about

My local hobby shop is about 110 miles away and there are a few others in the area. Going to the shop is an event as they are fairly well stocked and staffed by good people. Because of the camaraderie in the store customers as well as staff I was able to find out about a club that was very close to my house and join that club. In addition to a business relationship I feel that I have made some good friends as well. Prices are good, competitive with the internet sometimes a bit more sometimes less and service is excellent.

If you get the chance to Stop in to Discount Model Trains in Addison TX you will not be disappointed. If you look at one of Grande Pacific's videos you may see the owners layout. I can not remember the name of Arts video but it was posted in the last year and is a Santa Fe layout. Just go to his sight and look for a Dallas area layout.

Rob in Texas

Wunpost oil cans

Dave,

 I had to look that one up! I've never seen one of those as they come through my area in the early morning before daylight................since I'm a bit of a night owl I'm pretty heavy into the ZZZZZZZ's around that time!

they come through my area in the early morning

 Yeah, I was wondering if they ran in the dark. I'd love to see some oil cans, they were one of my favorite things to watch at Tehachapi. Up there they ran in the afternoon loaded and came back empty in the night so fans got to see the heavy one's running up the hill usually with around ten SD45's and Tunnel motors.......DaveB

The Death of the local Hobby shop

after reading ur article i noticed u put the blame to every 1 but who really is at fault here..E-bay has done more than its share of damage to the local hobby shop,between the out of this world pricing for crud trains crappy service and terrible ppl along with terrible attitude..how ppl still do business there is beyond me i lost my hobby shop to just that e-bay..but i seen it coming so moved to the internet long before i closed my door im still alive and kicking with 22 yrs in the model train industry im not going out with out a fight..i network on fb as well and sales are great...i do agree with the personal touch idea i give my customers 1 on 1 service and i ship faster than any 1 i know or deal with myself and i don't sell product that isn't on my shelves either like so many others do..i help my customers with there layouts giving them ideas and fixes that are tried and true so they can get in there and enjoy running there trains..we need the hobby shop like we need baseball and moms apple pie its just part of the American tradition we shouldn't turn our back on it nor should we support those businesses that don't support our economy but that's an entirely different conversation The Kentucky Trainman

I wasn't wishing them away

Demise of Local Hobby Shops

All the points covered in the Don's editorial are valid.

Back in 1992 I had a forced career change due to corporate downsizing and I seriously considered opening a brick and mortar hobby shop focused on Model Railroading.   There was a publication that gave a pretty good outline on how to build a business plan specifically for a retail hobby shop which I used along with my experience working for JMC, Con-Cor's full range wholesale distribution business.

I concluded that the amount of money needed to secure space, fixtures, insurance, initial inventory, and to cover startup period employee wages, utility expenses, etc., etc. was a very poor investment.    Not to mention the 12 hrs. or more a day seven days a week time commitment necessary to run the operation.  The old saw that the only way to make a small fortune in the Model Railroad Industry is to start with a large one is certainly true!

The quality of materials on the market has allowed people to "get into" the Hobby sooner with more satisfaction.  I believe there are more miles of track in operation today than in the past where layouts would be sitting in boxes because lack of some skill frustrated a would be Model Railroader into inactivity.

The advent of discounting through mail order and internet sales certainly has impacted the retail scene for our Hobby as it has all retailing.   But the biggest factor is the growth of chain retail stores, discount or otherwise, which set the overall environment (real estate costs, federal, state, and local taxes and accounting requirements, labor pools, zoning and construction regulations, etc.) in which mom & pop stores do not have the resources to compete/exist in even though no "big box" outfit sells the same merchandise.

The Model Railroad Industry is a specialty segment that does not enjoy the markup/product turn profitability that could support chain store sales.   Hobbytown USA is the only national chain that has survived and most of them are marginal as Model Railroad  specialty stores.   The Great American Train Stores looked promising for a while as destination train shops but apparently were structured with very unsound lease agreements which proved untenable.

One of the problems with the Hobby has always been the "lone wolf" aspect of Model Railroading.   Whether this is due to the "playing with trains" syndrome, fear of disclosing valuable collections to possible theft, or a inclination towards introversion for people attracted to the Hobby I am not sure.  How many of us live in a community where there are layouts down the block from our homes and we will never know it?

I have met more Model Railroad friends through the internet than I ever did from hanging out at Local Hobby Shops.  The net is improving our communication both on a technical and social level and facilitates possible face-to-face contact with fellow Hobbyists.

While I mourn the loss of brick and mortar hobby shops where I could go in to see "what's new" and physically inspect the merchandise before making a buy decision, the new age of digital publishing and convenience of internet purchasing have probably broadened access to the Hobby beyond what has been lost by the closing of shops.

In a way, saying that the Hobby of Model Railroading is dying because Local Hobby Shops are closing is like saying nobody is traveling anymore because all the buggy whip factories are out of business!

Charlie Vlk

Railroad Model Resources

Lone wolf modelers

This thought has occurred to me as well, although I would hesitate to call it a problem and think of it more as just a reality in more than a few cases.

The internet actually helps this lone wolf connect more, because you can be "alone" and yet still connected to the degree that you want to be, holding the discussion at arms length if you want. I don't think many of these lone wolf modelers are anti-social, they are just introverts and the private modeling time allows them to regenerate.

Once again, I think this is an area we simply need to learn to work with better, rather than get all wrapped around the axle about it as some kind of "big problem".

My only real concern with the loss of the hobby shops is how do we replace the face-to-face aspect of the hobby for those who need it? How do we provide in-the-flesh mentoring for those who are looking for that sort of thing? I don't think most hobby shops provided that directly, but they did show you who was local and acted as a catalyst for further interaction and mentoring outside the local hobby shop.

...

You have shows and keep the clubs running...

Ebay may have killed the middleman, but it saved the hobby for the end user.  Now I can get anything I want, without some middleman telling me "Oh, they don't make that anymore, you can't get it, but If I find one for you, it'll be an arm and a leg.  Tell you what, THIS item is a lot like it, why don't you just buy this from me instead?  Oh, it's not on the shelf, but if it's in the Walther's catalog, I can get it!"

No thanks...

Hobby Shops - Yet Another Basis of Friendship is Dwindling

Don,

      I'd like to comment on what I think is an important side point of your article, namely the loss of the social interaction dimension when local brick and mortar stores close down.  Most of us know that men are not particularly social creatures [thank goodness there are some women in this hobby].  For instance, many of us tend to shun face-to-face conversation with strangers.  But I think that most of us do enjoy talking about something we know about - whatever it is.  As you suggested, the hobby shop afforded us this opportunity just as the British Pub has done for centuries and as Starbucks does today, perhaps for a different generation.  The local hobby shop helped us round off some sharp corners and to communicate!

      However, we are seeing America's youth more and more focused on digital media and its interconnecting nervous system (the internet).  What I see is an ever widening gap between these young people: a dating couple both of whom are head-down while engrossed in texting (who knows whom?), teens' attention on tiny screens during class rather than on the text or board, even a whole family out to dinner together but never speaking to one another because each has their own "escape window."  If we are only concerned about the economics of a model railroad hobby shop in the future we will have missed the more important point that while our hobby may well continue the nature of society engaged in it will become very different from before.  Just as the content and style of communication changed when going from the teletype to telephone to SKYPE so model railroading must also change. Nevertheless, I will miss my local hobby shop, something is fading from view even as this is being written. 

how do we replace the face-to-face aspect of the hobby

Right here, we ask questions and folks answer them for us. The bonus is we are not limited to just those we can see in person, someone from across the county or around the world can help us as well as the guy across town. and as Benny said ebay and online shopping has made it a lot easier to find the products we need, our shop is now the whole internet. I'm working on converting a cryogenic reefer to mechanical reefer and a few minutes of searching turned up a nice BLMA ThermoKing unit all painted and ready to use, it will be here in a couple of days while I get the car ready for it... ...DaveB 

how do we replace the face-to-face aspect of the hobby

Shows, meets and conventions go a long way. In fact, on that note, let me thank you Joe in advance for opening your layout to conventions in 2015, if you elect to do that.

Volunteering to do a clinic, even a simple one, at a local meet puts you in direct F2F contact with others right away.

Another idea is not to overlook the need to announce the existence of your hobby activities. I do this in two ways. First, I bring the occasional model to work for a few days and just leave it displayed on my desk. Not on a side shelf or credenza, right on the front side of my desk. I'm in an office with 50 people. After I brought in a model the first time, I learned that two other employees were modelers! We had never discussed it before then. Now we chat every couple of weeks about what progress we have made at home. Second, I post the occasional shot of a completed model on my Facebook page. Not every week, maybe once every three months, and I ensure it's a beautiful color shot. This gets others talking and has been another way to find out about friends who are modelers.

I can drive to 7 hobby shops

I can drive to 7 hobby shops that have a decent model railroad selection within 30 minutes of me. We are in a railroad friendly pocket here. However, our NMRA division is terribly weak. But that is another thread...

Judging by the responses to my emails

Op Sessions ...

... would be a very logical replacement for the LHS as far as a "gathering together of model railroadists" goes.  Of course, 'somebody' has to host the durn thing ....

Another take

I fully agree with the point about retailers who saw the writing on the wall about 20 or so years ago and established an internet presence that has evolved along with the technology. 

One of the main things I've noticed over the years that I think has somewhat killed the LHS is over-diversification.  One of my favorite shops in Michigan used to have outstanding stock in 4 primary areas: trains, R/C, slot cars, and plastic models.  Their train area alone, I used to be able to spend nearly an hour just looking at their display cases, and they always had the newest releases that I was seeing on the pages of MR and RMC.  I moved away for a few years after college, then when I moved back, their stock had grown to include gaming miniatures, telescopes, puzzles, model rockets, etc., all at the expense of their former "specialties." They also rarely had new releases, but it was always "well, we can order it for you." Sorry, if I wanted to order it and wait for delivery, I can do that online. That store and others like it have since gone out of business.

I've been blessed to live in cities with 2 of the largest and most well known train stores: Miami (Ready to Roll) and Denver (Caboose Hobbies).  The best things about both stores? They do one thing and they do it well: trains. Period (OK, there are some minor exceptions, but you get my point). And they are able to service what they sell.  Both stores have rabid customer followings, not only locally, but both nationally and internationally, and I believe it's because they have built their reputations by not being "jack of all trades, master of none" but by mastering their primary focus and all of its facets, as well as keeping a decent selection of stock on the shelves, including new releases.

Mike in CO

LHS

I shop at my LHS it takes 40 mins to get there. The problem is manufactures are cutting back on products or elimating them like Tester Paints ie: Polly scale paints. Also some manufactures are elimating the middle man (distributers) and going direct to the customer via the internet. this causes the LHS to close due to the lack of business.. My LHS thinks he will be closed in the next 5 years.

Trooper 

Connecting with others

Anybody tried Meetup as a way to find others? I have tried 3 times to get a round robin group of some sort started for construction, conversation and learn about operation. "Just wanted to to see what you were doing" is an excuse that has worn itself out as far as I'm concerned. And at the point of sounding harsh shows a lack of honesty on the part of the people who acted like they were interested in starting a round robin group.

I may just give meetup a try. It has a tendency to work really well for some activities. 

On a side note, my wife and I got to visit South Coast Trains in Atascadero about 10-12 years ago. Very friendly and we bought far more than we planned on. 

Jack

Death of The LHS

I hate IE. Let's try this again in Firefox...

I am fortunate to live in Denver. Caboose Hobbies is about a 30 minute drive to the southern side of town, and the owner lives across the street from my aunt and uncle. We used to have another hobby shop much closer to my home, but they sold plastic models and R/C stuff as well, and I could never find anyone there who knew anything about trains. They went out of business a year or two ago. I did pick up some real bargains at their Going Out of Business Sale.

The problem with online stores is that they copy their descriptions off the boxes, so you get a sentence or two at most. If you know what you need that's fine. but I may not, in which case the description is mostly useless, and it's not like you can ask an employee. I figured I could do better, so I'm working on starting my own online train store. Each product gets a paragraph or more of information about the product, whatever I can find. It takes time to put together, but in the long run I believe it will add value.

I'm also using video to my advantage. Did you know that Bullfrog Snot has a video on how to "install" it? It's a great video with some humor, and a lot of valuable information, so I have it embedded on the product page so that anyone who thinks they might be interested in buying, can see what it is, what it does, and how it's used. I do that for every product I can find a video on, and expect to shoot my own for those products that don't have video. I already have some links listed for downloads both for my products, and for things like JMRI, which I've found a lot of model railroaders don't know about, the Digitrax Sound Depot, and anything else a model railroader might find useful at some point. It may not be quite the same as talking to the guy at the hobby shop, but it's a whole lot more than what I see the competition doing.

As for the 1 on 1, face 2 face, well, I can't really do the face 2 face, but I have a facebook page where I've so far been posting videos I think modelers might find interesting. The latest one was last week, about UP towing the BigBoy from CA to Salt Lake City, on it's way to restoration in Cheyenne. I can also post comments, and everything can be commented on by others, so conversations can be started. I plan to add a forum to the store, so that general and specific topics can be discussed, not to mention the possibility of creating a resource for finding clubs that are local to you. I'm also putting together a studio to shoot How To videos. You can think of them as virtual clinics, sort of like the LHS does on the weekends, except the videos are available for viewing 24/7/365.

I haven't been able to get a lot of products up yet. I have close to 1000 individual SKUs and as I said, it takes time to put everything together, especially since it too is a Lone Wolf operation. The facebook page above has a link to the store, and I plan to advertise in MRH once I get a majority of the products listed. I believe that Don was close in his thoughts about the future of online hobby shops. I may not be able to show you the individual product on video conference, but I have my 800 number prominently listed at the top, and you can call me if you have questions that aren't answered on the product page.

You see, the thing I see in all these posts lamenting the end of the LHS, is the loss of a community. Guys are worried that without the LHS, they won't have anywhere to go to talk about trains. Well, we already know that isn't true.